Talk:Pan-Green Coalition

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Taipei Times article on the Pan-Purple Alliance: formed by several social activist and disadvantaged groups --Kaihsu 06:38, 3 Sep 2003 (UTC)

Untitled

The Pan-Purple Alliance is against the DPP. Why does it redirect here? --Jia ng 10:48, 19 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Feedback from New Page Review process

I left the following feedback for the creator/future reviewers while reviewing this article: It is not clear to me that this is a distinct subject but there is enough out there and has been created enough times that I am marking as reviewed and would encourage someone who disagrees to take it to AfD..

Barkeep49 (talk) 00:58, 16 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Centrist?

If "Centre" is to be added to the political position of the infobox in the article, it needs a reliable source. The Democratic Progressive Party is leading the Pan-Green Coalition, while the Democratic Progressive Party and Pan-Green Coalition are not synonymous. Editing the political position of the Pan-Green Coalition as centrist with a source who referred to the DPP as "centrist" is a POV edit; per WP:SYNTH. For example, the Greens and Social Democrats are not centrist. ProKMT (talk) 00:42, 15 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Green parties are often centrist; and it doesn't change that the centrist DPP is part of this coalition. This makes a centrist appellation more appropriate than center-left. Please stop removing high-quality reliable sources like Routledge just because they don't match your POV. Simonm223 (talk) 13:17, 15 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Routledge source is relable sources, but the Routledge source doesn't say "Pan-Green [Coalition]" is a centrist. WP:ONUS rather proves Guotaian editing is wrong, and you are continuously restoring the POV editing of Guotaian. Again, all the sources put forward by Guotaian have only references to the "Democratic Progressive Party" but no references to the "Pan-Green Coalition".^[1] I won't erase the "Center" of infoobox's political position for now because I don't want an edit dispute, but it's absolutely true that considering Pan-Green as a centrist itself is POV; the DPP is not the only member of the Pan-Green Coalition, and the Social Democratic Party, Green Party Taiwan, and Taiwan Statebuilding Party are more radical and left-leaning positions for Taiwan independence. ProKMT (talk) 07:34, 16 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Guotaian I think considering how often your name has come up in this discussion you may want to be aware of it. Simonm223 (talk) 17:07, 16 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks. Just looking at the numbers, the DPP makes up the vast majority of the pan green camp. all Legislative yuan members and local leaders who are pan green are from the DPP and 277/290 of the pan green local councillors are DPP. I would be grateful if anyone can find a source specifically suggesting the the Pan green coalition is centrist.

I also added a bracket suggesting that the majority of the coalition is center to center left) not all. Guotaian (talk) 17:17, 16 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I question calling any party that explicitly adheres to anti-Communism "left" myself. And t hat applies to the Taiwan Statebuilding Party. I think there are a lot of low-quality sources being used to make broad claims about these parties. Simonm223 (talk) 17:21, 16 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I totally agree with you. I don't want to pick fights but Pro-KMT constantly disputes my edits and Pro-KMT's POV is that any "pro-CCP" party is supposedly "right-wing" while any anti-CPP party is "left-wing".

Pro-KMT does the same for Hong Kong political party pages such as claiming that the pro-beijing camp in HK is "center right" when its clearly a wide range of parties with different political positions just as the pro-democracy camp.

This is despite laying the facts down (right wing is generally business while left is pro labour), Pro-Kmt constantly changes the edits as it suits his agenda. Guotaian (talk) 17:28, 16 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Getting back to edits rather than people I want to give an example: this source is cited for calling the Taiwan Statebuilding Party / Basic Progressive Party a "big tent" party ideologically.

What it acutally does is argue quite passionately that, despite left-sounding rhetoric, the entirety of the pan-green coalition are pro-business land grabbers who use a veneer of progressivism (but not too fast) on social issues to cover for repeatedly backing landlords and institutional wealth on local economic and property issues. Simonm223 (talk) 17:35, 16 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The arguments that the two make now are typical WP:SYNTH. We need a source that mentions that "Pan-Green" is a centrist. Without such a source, "Centre" must be removed from the article's political position. In Taiwanese politics, "anti-communism" and "left" do not contradict. The DPP or TSP's "反共" are not right-wing "反共[產主義]" in the Western world. They are just "反[中國]共[產黨]" in the sense that they oppose the CCP. The Pan-Green Coalition's anti-communism has nothing to do with conservatism, so "left" is right. ProKMT (talk) 04:06, 18 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

"Anti-communism" (反共) has no effect on the DPP and TSP's economic or social policies. The DPP and TSP's "anti-communism" simply means that they oppose Chinese nationalism and support Taiwanese nationalism. This is not what we call "anti-communism" in the right-wing political context which has something to do with economic freedom or traditionalist conservatism in the global world. If the CCP supported Taiwan's independence, they would abandon "anti-communism". ProKMT (talk) 05:57, 18 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

References

^
- Derbyshire, J. Denis; Derbyshire, Ian (15 April 2016). Encyclopedia of World Political Systems. Vol. 1. Routledge. p. 108. ISBN 978-1-3174-7156-1. Archived from the original on 12 April 2023. Retrieved 10 January 2020.
- The Economist. Economist Newspaper Limited. 2011. p. 58. Archived from the original on 12 April 2023. Retrieved 10 January 2020.
- Business Asia. Business International Corporation. 2001. p. 40. Archived from the original on 12 April 2023. Retrieved 24 December 2020.
- "Taiwan". Freedom in the World 2002. Freedom House. 2002. Archived from the original on 26 December 2019. Retrieved 26 December 2019.

[1] 
Derbyshire, J. Denis; Derbyshire, Ian (15 April 2016). Encyclopedia of World Political Systems. Vol. 1. Routledge. p. 108. ISBN 978-1-3174-7156-1. Archived from the original on 12 April 2023. Retrieved 10 January 2020.
The Economist. Economist Newspaper Limited. 2011. p. 58. Archived from the original on 12 April 2023. Retrieved 10 January 2020.
Business Asia. Business International Corporation. 2001. p. 40. Archived from the original on 12 April 2023. Retrieved 24 December 2020.
"Taiwan". Freedom in the World 2002. Freedom House. 2002. Archived from the original on 26 December 2019. Retrieved 26 December 2019.

[2] Derbyshire, J. Denis; Derbyshire, Ian (15 April 2016). Encyclopedia of World Political Systems. Vol. 1. Routledge. p. 108. ISBN 978-1-3174-7156-1. Archived from the original on 12 April 2023. Retrieved 10 January 2020.

[3] The Economist. Economist Newspaper Limited. 2011. p. 58. Archived from the original on 12 April 2023. Retrieved 10 January 2020.

[4] Business Asia. Business International Corporation. 2001. p. 40. Archived from the original on 12 April 2023. Retrieved 24 December 2020.

[5] "Taiwan". Freedom in the World 2002. Freedom House. 2002. Archived from the original on 26 December 2019. Retrieved 26 December 2019.

[1]