Talk:Ouzo

Untitled

Does anyone know why ouzo goes milky when you put water in it?

Answered! Have a nice day! --Spudtater 01:39, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Cheers!

THIS ARTICLE SHOULD BE MERGED WITH ARAK, as it is essentially the same liquor.

Cheers, Project2501a! :)(a sound of two glasses colliding)... is there a Wikipedia non-alchololism policy somewhere around? --FlavrSavr 08:35, 22 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Yes, there is: "Thou salt not edit while sober" Project2501a 00:31, 25 July 2005 (UTC)

Louching is the term when the terpenes in absinthe become milky white when cold water is mixed with it. This action is the same when cool water is added to ouzo. I do disagree with the article that ouzo could be a substitute for absinthe without the wormwood. A better substitution would be Pernod, which is from the original manufacturer of absinthe, and is truly absinthe without the wormwood (and yes, the louches also). - Dan, Miami Beach, swanny2070@earthlink.net

The article does not claim that ouzo is absinthe without the wormwood - it merely says that such a claim was once made, and cites Encyclopeadia Britannica as its source Moletrouser (talk) 07:48, 2 August 2010 (UTC)

Church of Ouzo

i think it would be best if the Church of Ouzo entry were split off, and a disambiguation page generated. the two appear to be completely different things. Anastrophe 21:03, 4 December 2005 (UTC) _________________________________________________________

Not any more unrelated than the game Liar's poker and the book of the same name. RME

that's pretty much my point. they are only barely noteworthy to the main article. Anastrophe 21:04, 5 December 2005 (UTC)

I agree they are both footnotes in the sense of being related to but of lesser importance than the main article, but I feel such segues also provide some measure of article enhancement. RME

I agree with Delirium who deleted the stuff about the Church of Ouzo. The phrasing was POV anyway. If someone cares, they should start a new article and add a link in the "See Also" section here, IMO. Alex.g 11:11, 7 January 2006 (UTC)

how much water?

This article should probably say what the water-to-ouzo ratio should be... —alxndr (t) 01:46, 30 January 2006 (UTC)

I do not put any water into my ouzo -- just a 3 or 4 ice cubes! This allows me to (almost ritualistically) watch the ouzo effect take place as the ice cubes melt and drink my ouzo when it is just right. For me, drinking ouzo is something that I don't do unless I have a lot of time that I can spend enjoying it! Dave ©¿©¬ (talk) 05:29, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

Ouzo 7, Ouzo 12

I've seen numbering of ouzos (here in Israel, where, I disclaim, everything tends to be messed up food-wise). I've assumed this is a reference to the amount of time aged; is it months? Years? Stupid branding? Cheers! --Mgreenbe 01:20, 8 February 2006 (UTC)

I believe that they're just brands.I think Ouzo 12 is actually named after the number of the barrel it was stored in when it's producer was just a small family distillery.Or maybe that was Ouzo 7, I'm not sure.--Jsone 21:01, 8 February 2006 (UTC)

Confirmed by the Google search I should have done in the beginning. I'll stick to arak (a steal at 18 shekels = US$4 per liter). Thanks! --Mgreenbe 21:28, 8 February 2006 (UTC)

It's just a matter of taste, you can add as much as you want. I tend to drink it straight. --Peter

Liqueur/ Liquor

In the opening paragraph Ouzo is described as a Liqueur. In the article on absinthe, that spirit is described as a liquor because "does not contain added sugar". No mention is made of sugar being added to Ouzo. Is it not therefore a liquor? Also, is the reason "The history of ouzo is somewhat murky" because it has been watered down over the years? --Dashers 05:36, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

Liqueur/ Liquor 2

If I may add my 2 cents to user:Dashers, there is an inconsistency between Ouzo and absinthe. It is unclear which is a liqueur and which a liquor. In the List of liqueurs there is a note: "Absinthe, Arak, Rakı, and similar anise-flavored beverages contain no sugar and thus are flavored liquors rather than liqueurs.", but ouzo is included in the "Anise-flavored liqueurs". In the Flavored liquor page, the same distinction is made: "They are distinct from liqueurs in that liqueurs have a high sugar content, whereas flavored liquors contain no added sugar." As far as I know, ouzo does not contain added sugar and it is certainly not sweet. It is distilled from raisins with added flavors. According to [1] the making of liqueurs includes sweetening. According to [2] ouzo is a liqueur, because it is a flavored spirit and not because of sugar content. According to [3], liqueurs are sweet and both ouzo and absinthe are liqueurs. So, the confusion is general. I propose that both absinthe and ouzo be put in the same category, either the Flavored liquor one (which makes more sense to me) or the liqueur one. Helentr (talk) 22:59, 26 October 2008 (UTC)

That seems reasonable to me; I've changed the intro to say "anise-flavored spirit" instead of "anise-flavored liqueur", which uses the same terminology as the absinthe article. As far as actual categories go, both are in Category:Anise liqueurs and spirits, whose name is neutral as to whether it's a liqueur or some other kind of spirit. --Delirium (talk) 22:38, 27 October 2008 (UTC)

Thank you for the swift response --Helentr (talk) 15:32, 30 October 2008 (UTC)

There are ouzos which are quite sweet (especially from Southern Greece), and there are completely dry ones. Not sure though, if the sweet ones have a sugar content high enough to qualify them as liqueurs. I seriously doubt it. 31.24.11.129 (talk) 17:36, 4 June 2023 (UTC)

Similarities

I'd say ouzo is more similar to pastis, sambuca and arak than absinthe.

• Well yes. Ouzo, pastis, and sambuca all have anise as the primary flavour, with other herbs added as complements. Absinthe's flavour results from the synergy between anise and wormwood, which is, to put it euphemistically, a right bit more challenging to the palate than anise by itself. Wormwoodpoppies 17:09, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

I disagree, at least partly. Some absinthes, especially the Swiss "bleues" (clear/white ones) are not radically different from ouzo or pastis, because they have a high anise content. Pastis contains liquorice besides the anise, in an amount that just can't be ignored. Ouzo may also contain herbs and seeds other than anise, which complement its aroma. I would say sambuca is the odd one out here, because it's a liqueur, it's a lot sweeter than the others. An Italian equivalent to the other dry anise liquors would rather be Mistra , from the Marche region. 31.24.11.129 (talk) 17:29, 4 June 2023 (UTC)

Correction: green absinthe gets its colour from a mazeration with colouring herbs (such as artemisia pontica) after the distillation. (Any colour would't survive the distillation.) Clear/white absinthe doesn't get mazerated after the distillation; that's the main reason why it's not this dissimilar to ouzo or pastis. 31.24.11.129 (talk) 17:45, 4 June 2023 (UTC)

But, it's important to understand that bleue/clear/white absinthe doesn't necessarily have a low content of wormwood. Because of its extreme bitterness, wormwood isn't typically used as a colouring herb, hence the colour of an absinthe doesn't give any clue about the wormwood content. 31.24.11.129 (talk) 18:02, 4 June 2023 (UTC)

ouzo....cocaine?????

A friend of mine came back from duty in the US Navy in 1968....He brought us a bottle of OUZO and told us that one of the ingredients was cocaine....was there any truth to this for a bottle produced in Greece in the 1960's??? Thanks ahead of time for any answers....216.230.184.65 16:44, 13 November 2006 (UTC)JOE216.230.184.65 16:44, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

• Very unlikely, unless this was "special" ouzo he purchased from a home-distiller. Or there's a tiny chance it may have contained de-cocainised coca leaf. But by 1968 coke was banned or tightly cotrolled pretty much the world over, so it's more likely than not that this should be filed along with "LSD from Foster's beer" and "absinthe makes you trip ballllz, d00d" Wormwoodpoppies 17:05, 27 November 2006 (UTC).
• Urban myth. The story I heard circulating in the 1980s was that Ouzo was made with opium or morphine. Never found any evidence this was true. Dragomiloff 02:21, 25 January 2007 (UTC)
• Urban (or US Navy) myth. I've visited ouzo distilleries and seen the ingredients. Lots of anise seed. No cocaine. Andrew Dalby 10:12, 25 January 2007 (UTC)
• I'd call this about as true as the joke that as a Greek liquer, it is distilled from crippling debt. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.216.68.87 (talk) 18:14, 6 July 2015 (UTC)

When I was in the US Navy, the captain of our ship, the USS Seattle, addressed the crew over the PA system in 1980 before we hit the Greek port of Athens regarding his sailors illegally imbibing opium-based ouzo. He said that while it was understood that "everyone" knew it was against UCMJ, that he knew it would happen anyway. He then went on to explain how to...drink ouzo responsibly, and how to avoid certain dangerous repercussions. It was very confusing. The upshot is this: There is no truth to theories that ouzo contains cocaine, but the US Navy did believe that the genuine drink (not the alcohol-based drink authorized for sale within the US) did in fact contain opium. There was no suggestion whatsoever that ouzo was like absinthe in chemical composition; just because different drinks share the same FLAVORING ingredients does not mean that they share the same intoxicants. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2605:6000:6BC9:E800:5D95:3429:F0B8:9B15 (talk) 11:12, 29 September 2020 (UTC)

Lesvos // Lesbos

There seems to be some debate as to the correct transliteration of the name of the island in question. The article for that island calls it Lesbos, but it refers to an attraction on that island as the Petrified Forests of Lesvos. Businesses in that area also call their island Lesvos (as in lesvos.net, lesvos.gr, lesvos.co.uk and so on). The Greek spelling is Λέσβου; the beta character is pronounced as the letter V. The "b" sound in Greek is made by μπ. It would therefore appear that the proper English spelling of Λέσβου is "Lesvos".Flakeloaf 15:11, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

As often happens, there's more than one proper spelling. The beta character made the sound b in ancient Greek, and Lesbos is nearly always spelt with a b in English by people who are talking about its history, and by people who first heard about it in a classical context; also by people who are aware of the connection with lesbianism! I suppose one could try searching Google to see which spelling is commoner right now. Andrew Dalby 12:59, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Google search for "lesbos" at your peril :) Flakeloaf 15:11, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Ouzo similar to absinthe?

Since when is ouzo similar to absinthe? Absinthe is an extremely strong spirit, whereas ouzo, while strong, is not to that extent.--Orthologist 14:39, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

Yes, you're right. I have changed this sentence, likening it to pastis instead. OK? Andrew Dalby 16:35, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

POV has been eliminated and absinthe substitute put back in based on Encyclopaedia Britannica reference. RME

The EB claim seems highly POV to me; at the very least it needs to be more explicit. For whom is ouzo a substitute for absinthe? Not for its current drinkers, most of whom have never had any exposure to absinthe and many of whom have probably never heard of it. For its 19th century market? But at that time absinthe itself was accessible to those who wanted it, so was any substitute needed? Encyclopedias can get things wrong, as we know! I have put the EB claim in a footnote temporarily: it would be good to have a verbatim citation and to know which EB article this comes from. (User:Andrew Dalby)

I recall seeing it in the Micropaedia article on ouzo. RME

Well, thanks. If the EB said it, I suppose their author must have meant that ouzo (which already existed before absinthe was widely banned) became more popular in the early 1900s as a substitute for the newly unobtainable absinthe. Maybe so (I wonder if said author did any research on this). As you will know if you have drunk both, there is not much resemblance either in the method of serving, or in the alcohol content, or in the flavour!

My feeling (tell me if you disagree!) is that this information doesn't serve to characterise ouzo as it is today, though it may say something of the marketing of ouzo in the early 20th century. Therefore, maybe it belongs later in the article. Andrew Dalby 18:39, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

For the present I have inserted this description a bit later on, in the history section of the article, as you'll see. I can't verify the quote -- in the 1953 EB, which I have, ouzo seems not to be mentioned. Andrew Dalby 20:03, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

As you will know if you have drunk both, there is not much resemblance either in the method of serving, or in the alcohol content, or in the flavour! Apparently you've never had most of what passes for absinthe, since it typically reeks of anise and in fact tastes almost exactly like ouzo! Especially Czech absinthe! Which is 98% of the world market! --76.224.92.30 07:04, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

The "POV" referred to by RME above was presumably the statement that ouzo was "pleasant to drink"! I have taken the offending word out.Andrew Dalby 12:46, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

/*What is it made from?*/ What exactly is it fermented from? The article isn't clear.

Name

Bella Online link is dead: [4]. It might be retrievable via The Internet Archive, but that's down today too. Gordonofcartoon 13:18, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

An interesting theory on the etymology of the word 'Ouzo'. In Europe, many drinkable spirits were known by the name 'water of life' (the Scots 'whisky' and Irish 'Whiskey' derive from the gaelic 'uisce beatha' deriving from the latin 'aqua vita'. The scandinavian spirit Akavit having the same route). In Greek this could be rendered νερό ζώου or nero zoo (literally the water of living things). Ouzo is a fairly obvious abreviation from that I would have thought. I should say this is just a theory. I can cite no reference or evidence here. Just thought it might be worth a mention. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.192.19.125 (talk) 20:14, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

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BetacommandBot (talk) 23:53, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

Lack of milky color

I was just served ouzo with ice, and it was totally clear, no milky color. Is that possible? Badagnani (talk) 05:36, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Original milkiness?

Why doesn't the ouzo become cloudy in the manufacturing process when water is added to the ouzo yeast: "they simply dilute ouzo yeast with water (and add sugar if needed)?" 76.123.203.164 (talk) 12:52, 2 February 2008 (UTC)

This is discussed in a bit more detail in the article on ouzo effect. It seems to have to do with the concentration of ethanol (higher concentrations don't result in cloudiness), but isn't actually that well understood. --Delirium (talk) 13:00, 2 February 2008 (UTC)

Thank you!76.123.203.164 (talk) 13:33, 2 February 2008 (UTC)

Etymology

Sir G. Clauson, An Etymological Dictionary of Pre-Thirteenth Century Turkish, Oxford 1972, page 288 says that the word "ouzo" derives from the word "üzüm", which means grapes in Turkish. --Tubesship (talk) 17:34, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

Making Ouzo in Ancient Times, before invention of distillation ?

Abu Musa Jābir ibn Hayyān al azdi known as Geber in west who lived in Khorasan which was a Turkish and Persian city in the 8th century, invented distillation.It is not possible to make a distilled liqueur before that time :) 88.255.50.1 (talk) 16:05, 1 March 2010 (UTC)

That depends on the definition of the word "ancient". In France, they generally consider "ancient" to be more than 100 years old. However, personally I agree with you. 8th century isn't truly ancient. Neither are the Byzantine or Ottoman Empires. However, I did once see a laughable description of the "Ancient Ottoman Empire" on a large exhibit at the British Museum. Just goes to show that the word "ancient" isn't always used correctly (not even by historians and archaeologists) Nipsonanomhmata (talk) 10:25, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

The claim that Jabir invented distillation in the 8th century BCE is a bit funny since it is a documented process described in existing writing from ancient Greek Alexandria at least as early as 2nd century BCE. Alcoholic beverage distillation is Chinese in origin

Distillation: earliest documented Greeks 1-2nd BCE Alcoholic beverage distillation: earliest documented Chinese 10th BCE108.18.70.239 (talk) 23:46, 20 August 2013 (UTC)

Raki, Tsikoudia, Tsipouro and Mastiha

These alcoholic drinks also exist in Greece. They are not usually anise-flavored in Greece. It is confusing to claim that they are in the context of Ouzo. I wouldn't be surprised if there are anise-flavored variations of raki, tsikoudia or tsipouro but one has to explain that these products are not usually anise-flavored in Greece. Also, raki, tsikoudia and tsipouro are not aperitifs. They are generally "burn your gullet" "eau de vie" spirits. Although I wouldn't recommend getting drunk on Ouzo since it will deliver the worst kind of hangover. Mastiha is something completely different. It is not usually anise-flavored. At least not in most of the places where I have tried it in Greece. For the anise-flavored version of Mastiha you have to explain that there are non-anise flavored versions of it that are much more common. Have also noticed that there is a drink called "Mastiha Ouzo". I am not sure if this is an anise-flavored Mastiha or Ouzo with the brand-name "Mastiha". If Mastiha is used as a base for Ouzo it will be a completely different drink and should not really be called Ouzo (but I guess they can get away with calling it "Mastiha Ouzo"). Nipsonanomhmata (talk) 10:40, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

I think it depends on the part of Greece. In my experience, Tsipouro in Macedonia (Northern Greece) is most commonly anise-flavored, and seen as more or less a home-made variant of ouzo. --Delirium (talk) 13:12, 2 August 2010 (UTC)

These may be called tsipouro colloquially, but since tsipouro and tsikoudia are GIs for local pomace spirits [5], and as such, may not have a dominant flavouring, anise spirits with whatever base spirit may not be legally labeled as tsipouro or tsikoudia in Greece. As for mastiha, there are many ouzo flavoured with mastic, hence the legally accepted name overlap, but mastiha on its own is not anise flavoured. – Phoney (talk) 07:35, 8 January 2014 (UTC)

Indeed tsipouro with anise is sold in Greece - one can assume, legally - under the name "tsipouro" ([6]) ; the law says "Grape marc spirit or grape marc shall not be flavoured. This shall not exclude traditional production methods." so you can not use it as an argument against the existence of anise-flavoured tsipouro.--Phso2 (talk) 22:20, 8 January 2014 (UTC)

Indeed. I had known about the exception of traditional methods, but I also falsely assumed that pomace character was required to be predominant. Thanks for the information! – Phoney (talk) 09:19, 9 January 2014 (UTC)

Ouzo production does not include any fermentation...

So where does the ethanol come from? "Agricultural origin" does imply fermenation of some sort of biomass, does it not? Moletrouser (talk) 08:01, 2 August 2010 (UTC)

The article does not consider the production of rectified spirit (officially named ethyl alcohol of agricultural origin by EU regs) to be part of ouzo making itself. The base spirit isn't even made by the ouzo distiller; they buy it as a base ingredient. Just like harvesting wheat is not strictly a part of bread making. – Phoney (talk) 10:58, 15 September 2013 (UTC)

I was wondering about this too. At least, I'd like to know what grain the ethanol is typically made from. tharsaile (talk) 15:21, 15 September 2016 (UTC)

Anethole added

The option of pre-added anethole doesn't appear in EU regulations, though 0,05% would be a decisive part of the final amount. I think the information should be considered wrong unless present Greek regulations (which I couldn't find) state different. – Phoney (talk) 15:53, 6 December 2011 (UTC)

It seems that as a European distilled anis, ouzo is allowed to contain essences added. – Phoney (talk) 11:09, 8 December 2011 (UTC)